(07-06-2014, 01:35 AM)Falaflame Wrote: Okay, i'd love for you to point out anywhere in my post where I said Templar had a statistical advantage.I worded that poorly. You implied that not getting one-rounded by mithril magic+aurora was something unique to templars. That is not a unique advantage.
Quote:Though, since light magic has more crit, they're better at pursuit sharping. But that's a different argument for a different day.Actually, that's the first thing you've mentioned that templar legitimately does better. I don't normally think about pursuit sharp, although that is a unique advantage it has.
Quote:I use a templar, rather than a DK, because, maybe I already have a dark type on my team (such as a Lunar Kn) and I don't want to have a crippling weakness on my team to a certain type. I can make the same argument about a Templar. I want a DK on my team, because I already have a shimmer dodge tank Solar Kn.In summary, you use a templar because it's light, not because it's a templar. Thank you for proving my point.
Quote:3 Mt disadvantage or not, their target still dies to the next hit by whatever unit you use. Because at a high level of play, almost no units will be ORKOable. Yes, there's a difference between the two, but more likely than not, the difference isn't so huge that it's the difference between you surviving or you dying. It's more than just "templars are just there so they have WTA against DKs".That mt difference matters when you start factoring in toys. You're not going to attack every unit on a first strike, and your opponent won't be able to heal every unit they have that's taken damage. Meaning, even under optimal conditions where you're the one first striking, damage from toys will still come into play.
Take a standard dual tank DK with 34/18/14 defenses and dumped speed. It takes 30 damage from pursuit verrine (19 spd here) and 26 from pursuit aura (if you have 18 spd, then only if the DK is holding a 1 or 2 wt). It takes 7 damage from reliable short bow (norms) or unforged hatchet (tournament). 7+30>34, and 7+26<34, meaning their DK needs to attack a reliable hatchet user to put itself in ORKO range for a templar, but anything will do for a DK. Speedy DK also "one-rounds" a 34/20/14 wyvern rider that's taken hatchet damage (and a 36/20/13 wyvern rider if it was a reliable hatchet). Given only a small amount of prior damage, speedy DK can "one-round," while speedy templar cannot, so I would not say that the mt difference doesn't matter. For the record, templar would do 28 damage against the dual tank DK if it had just one more point of mt, which would be a kill.
Quote:I mentioned Wyvern Fighter because it was merely an example of building teams. I never said Wyvern Fighter was a bad class. I could've done the whole Templar vs DK thing again, but that's been done to death already. Maybe I should've stuck with that.I didn't say that you said it was a bad class. But talking about wyvern fighter doesn't really do anything to refute my central point, which is most sword/light/lance/anima users don't have the stats to be worth picking for their own merit. Wyvern fighter is one of the few ones that do, so good for it. It doesn't need buffing. The others do.
Quote:That wasn't my main conflicting view there. My argument was, that Axe/Dark/Bows aren't so auto-win like some people make them out to be. I have teams myself that punish that type of gameplay. Speedy/Vaike - IX has /plenty/ of teams that are made to counter that type of play. My point is, there's never a fool-proof team. And as long as RNG exists in FETO, there never will be.But what does this have to do with unit balance? Sure, there's no such thing as a fool-proof team. Why would I claim otherwise? But what on earth does that have to do with axe and dark units being statistically better than lance/sword/anima/light users? Just because you need other unit types to not run into weapon triangle problems doesn't mean the units wielding those other weapon types are good.
Do you think the game is balanced right now? Do you really think that non-dark/axe/bow users don't need any help whatsoever? I was hoping for this topic to turn into a discussion about what units would need what stats and where to balance them, to give them a suitable niche beyond just the fact that they use a certain weapon type. What I was not looking for was to get sidetracked talking about how you need more than just axe/dark to have a balanced team, something I am painfully aware of.